More physics puns and everything has bulldoze and counter charge. I can do seven factions. No, I don't think I have a problem.
Also as per discussion with Ed (not mine btw, I wish I could do that):
Thursday, March 28, 2013
Axis (Cyriss Warcaster) on Insider
http://privateerpress.com/community/privateer-insider/insider-3-27-2013
More physics puns and everything has bulldoze and counter charge. I can do seven factions. No, I don't think I have a problem.
Also as per discussion with Ed (not mine btw, I wish I could do that):
More physics puns and everything has bulldoze and counter charge. I can do seven factions. No, I don't think I have a problem.
Also as per discussion with Ed (not mine btw, I wish I could do that):
Wednesday, March 27, 2013
Deployment
Listening to the latest road to war today and they mentioned something I have been doing and that I haven't noticed and that is bunching together in the centre for deployment. There are a few reasons to do this:
It gives you the opportunity to pick the battles each unit is fighting. There are quite a few matches where I have deployed first and then first turn ran my units diagonally to give them more favourable opponents, you can't do that if you are way out on a flank.
It gives you flexibility, you can plan out your first turn really well but when it comes to turn 2-4 stuff starts to happen, dice become important and your opponents strategy and the objective start impacting on your game. If you want to change the spells that each unit has or suddenly need to get more models into a scoring area you can do it if your army is towards the centre, if you have a unit way out on a flank you can't do that.
Splitting your army allows your opponent to piece trade without losing anything. If you have a unit of banes behind your satyxis they will murder anything that kills them if however your satyxis are far away from the rest of your army your opponent can concentrate force on those satyxis, wipe them out and then you are just down the points for that unit. Sticking with the Satyxis example this also includes running them too far forwards. If you can't jam me and keep me out of the scoring zone running up your satyxis their full distance is only going to get them murdered.
Like all good rules there are exceptions. The raptors in my legion army quite often deploy not on the edge of the table but further out that other units. They have the speed to still get to the other side of the table if they need to and I'm not worried about piece trading because they use their range and light cav move to stay out of range. Especially if I am playing Rhyas and they are stealthed. Fast solos and ranged units are generally all right on a flank if they don't make use of any support the army provides. In particular the type of solos that always trade up like mage hunter assassins. Even then they should not be on the table edge, just slightly more edgewards.
Other things I've said before but I'll include in the deployment post for completeness. Know what needs to go together. You should have an idea how to deploy your list when you build it. For example in my Vayl2 lists the spawning vessel goes in the middle of my legionnaires unit at the front. It moves 6 they move 10, I want it up the table to collect as many corpses as possible. They go in the open and my battlegroup deploys behind terrain because they fly and have pathfinder. It takes me a minute to deploy because I know where things go. If you don't know that you can give yourself order of activation issues on turn 1 and that is never a good thing. I have seen a player trample Nemo with a Stormwall because they needed the distance to drop a pod and then chain lightning it. It could have been avoided if Nemo was off to the side of the Stormwall instead of tucked up against it. I find in most lists I can have my warcaster go first and cast all their buffs without moving. You only need one model from each unit in range and that's not particularly difficult if you know where those buffs are going and take it into account when deploying.
It gives you the opportunity to pick the battles each unit is fighting. There are quite a few matches where I have deployed first and then first turn ran my units diagonally to give them more favourable opponents, you can't do that if you are way out on a flank.
It gives you flexibility, you can plan out your first turn really well but when it comes to turn 2-4 stuff starts to happen, dice become important and your opponents strategy and the objective start impacting on your game. If you want to change the spells that each unit has or suddenly need to get more models into a scoring area you can do it if your army is towards the centre, if you have a unit way out on a flank you can't do that.
Splitting your army allows your opponent to piece trade without losing anything. If you have a unit of banes behind your satyxis they will murder anything that kills them if however your satyxis are far away from the rest of your army your opponent can concentrate force on those satyxis, wipe them out and then you are just down the points for that unit. Sticking with the Satyxis example this also includes running them too far forwards. If you can't jam me and keep me out of the scoring zone running up your satyxis their full distance is only going to get them murdered.
Like all good rules there are exceptions. The raptors in my legion army quite often deploy not on the edge of the table but further out that other units. They have the speed to still get to the other side of the table if they need to and I'm not worried about piece trading because they use their range and light cav move to stay out of range. Especially if I am playing Rhyas and they are stealthed. Fast solos and ranged units are generally all right on a flank if they don't make use of any support the army provides. In particular the type of solos that always trade up like mage hunter assassins. Even then they should not be on the table edge, just slightly more edgewards.
Other things I've said before but I'll include in the deployment post for completeness. Know what needs to go together. You should have an idea how to deploy your list when you build it. For example in my Vayl2 lists the spawning vessel goes in the middle of my legionnaires unit at the front. It moves 6 they move 10, I want it up the table to collect as many corpses as possible. They go in the open and my battlegroup deploys behind terrain because they fly and have pathfinder. It takes me a minute to deploy because I know where things go. If you don't know that you can give yourself order of activation issues on turn 1 and that is never a good thing. I have seen a player trample Nemo with a Stormwall because they needed the distance to drop a pod and then chain lightning it. It could have been avoided if Nemo was off to the side of the Stormwall instead of tucked up against it. I find in most lists I can have my warcaster go first and cast all their buffs without moving. You only need one model from each unit in range and that's not particularly difficult if you know where those buffs are going and take it into account when deploying.
Tuesday, March 26, 2013
Are Minions a Big Boy Faction Now?
Having a shit day, well week if I'm honest but I've got some time while I wait for other people so I going to take a break and think about Warmachine. Also blogging from my phone for the first time so we'll see how that goes.
With the releases in Wrath Ret moved up to the point where I now feel that Ret is as good as any of the original factions in the game. Their colossal and Vyros2 also helped a fair bit as well. However up until the most recent release I was not confident that minions were on the same page. Now though I think they may be. So briefly
what do you need to be a big boy faction?
You need answers for:
High ARM - Pigs have warhogs and Midas has Battle Lust. Rask has upkeep removal and Fury.
High DEF - Rask has upkeep removal, Drang has pack hunter, Calaban has Gatormen with Carnivore.
Top Tier Casters:
Haley2 - Rask handles the match up. Carver and Midas can probably do alright too.
Asphixious2 - Slaughterhousers remove from play so pigs have game. Rask can gator toss through the clouds, cares a lot less about excarnated bile thralls and can make himself unkillable.
Lylyth2 - Barnabas absolutely destroys her. Rask has a game.
Morvhana2 - Yep she's here now - Carver, Rask has a game.
Irusk1 - Rask. Pigs can probably do it with Sturm and Drang.
You need to have someone scary that other factions should be worried about and in this case it is Rask.
Minions are also starting to develop their own character, for example their warbeasts are kind of mopey but carried by their excellent casters. I won't be bringing them to the super series because I don't have nearly enough prep time but I will bring them to a tournament this year. I think a pairing of Rask and Midas or Carver or Sturm and Drang or Barnabas is very competitive. In the end that will be the test but I think it says a lot that I am
confident enough in the faction to try.
With the releases in Wrath Ret moved up to the point where I now feel that Ret is as good as any of the original factions in the game. Their colossal and Vyros2 also helped a fair bit as well. However up until the most recent release I was not confident that minions were on the same page. Now though I think they may be. So briefly
what do you need to be a big boy faction?
You need answers for:
High ARM - Pigs have warhogs and Midas has Battle Lust. Rask has upkeep removal and Fury.
High DEF - Rask has upkeep removal, Drang has pack hunter, Calaban has Gatormen with Carnivore.
Top Tier Casters:
Haley2 - Rask handles the match up. Carver and Midas can probably do alright too.
Asphixious2 - Slaughterhousers remove from play so pigs have game. Rask can gator toss through the clouds, cares a lot less about excarnated bile thralls and can make himself unkillable.
Lylyth2 - Barnabas absolutely destroys her. Rask has a game.
Morvhana2 - Yep she's here now - Carver, Rask has a game.
Irusk1 - Rask. Pigs can probably do it with Sturm and Drang.
You need to have someone scary that other factions should be worried about and in this case it is Rask.
Minions are also starting to develop their own character, for example their warbeasts are kind of mopey but carried by their excellent casters. I won't be bringing them to the super series because I don't have nearly enough prep time but I will bring them to a tournament this year. I think a pairing of Rask and Midas or Carver or Sturm and Drang or Barnabas is very competitive. In the end that will be the test but I think it says a lot that I am
confident enough in the faction to try.
Saturday, March 23, 2013
The Ranged Game
Won the mangled metal/tooth and claw tournament today with Vayl2 and it has reinforced something that I'm noticing more and more about Warmachine and that is that you need at least one of your lists to have a good ranged game. You can mitigate this if you have a really strong jam list but I think that there are too many lists out there that will walk all over lists without guns. With Vayl2 if my opponents did not have either I always felt in complete control of the game. I feel the same way with Haley2, Saeryn and Vayl1. When denial lists are able to deny you without consequence they walk all over you. I'm still kind of surprised at the lack of guns that I have seen at local tournaments, the only gun heavy lists I have come accross were Ossyan lists and Vayl2 kind of owns that match up too. Maybe I should add denial to my list of things you need to be prepared for when coming into a tournament. You don't need a list to be as gun crazy as some of my Cygnar lists but you do need enough guns to make a denial list pay for what they deny you.
Just quickly on Jam - Cryx are the masters of Jam and good jam is also a strong counter to denial lists. If you get a sizable force in your opponents face quickly (I direct you in particular to the post just before this one and Scott Wray's Skarre1 list) then you can stop them from being able to use their denial tricks. With Haley2 in particular if you can force her to feat defensively then you are more than halfway to winning the match, allow her to feat offensively and you are out of the game. As a rule of thumb you have a strong jam list if you have a sizable force on or across the centre-line on turn 1 when you go first. Going back to Scott's list for a moment, there are two unit of Bloodgorgers at 22" and two units of satyxis raiders up to 30" across. Playing a Haley2 or a Deneghra2 against that list you are pretty much forced to feat turn 2 or run into charge range of those models. Otherwise come the Cryx players turn they get pretty much their entire army between your army and the nearest scoring zones and you lose on scenario. Against Vayl2 it makes it very hard to make use of adminition and refuge and still be relevant in scenario. Whereas if you aren't accross the table then I can refuge back and admonition and still be in scoring areas and if you have no guns to shoot my stuff then nothing of mine ever dies (every single model I lost today was to a ranged attack or from an action forced upon me by a ranged attack).
Just quickly on Jam - Cryx are the masters of Jam and good jam is also a strong counter to denial lists. If you get a sizable force in your opponents face quickly (I direct you in particular to the post just before this one and Scott Wray's Skarre1 list) then you can stop them from being able to use their denial tricks. With Haley2 in particular if you can force her to feat defensively then you are more than halfway to winning the match, allow her to feat offensively and you are out of the game. As a rule of thumb you have a strong jam list if you have a sizable force on or across the centre-line on turn 1 when you go first. Going back to Scott's list for a moment, there are two unit of Bloodgorgers at 22" and two units of satyxis raiders up to 30" across. Playing a Haley2 or a Deneghra2 against that list you are pretty much forced to feat turn 2 or run into charge range of those models. Otherwise come the Cryx players turn they get pretty much their entire army between your army and the nearest scoring zones and you lose on scenario. Against Vayl2 it makes it very hard to make use of adminition and refuge and still be relevant in scenario. Whereas if you aren't accross the table then I can refuge back and admonition and still be in scoring areas and if you have no guns to shoot my stuff then nothing of mine ever dies (every single model I lost today was to a ranged attack or from an action forced upon me by a ranged attack).
Friday, March 22, 2013
Inter Mountain Cup
The Inter Mountain Cup was run at the same time as Mayhem and it was won by Chain Attack's Scott Wray. His lists:
Tier 4 Shore Leave
Pirate Queen Skarre -6
Bloodgorgers (Leader and 9 Grunts) 8
Satyxis Raiders (Leader and 5 Grunts) 5
Satyxis Raiders (Leader and 5 Grunts) 5
General Gerlak Slaughterborn 3
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Satyxis Raider Captain 2
Satyxis Raider Captain 2
This is an interesting theme fore, the Harrower and Leviathan get advance deployment, the Bloodgorgers get advance move and the Satyxis already have advance deployment and are stupid fast. This list gets up in your face fast and then Skarre feats you to death. I really like it and I'm surprised more people don't play this theme force. I suppose last year jam wasn't as powerful as it is this year.
Tier 4 Witching Hour
Warwitch Deneghra -5
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Pistol Wraith 3
Pistol Wraith 3
Warwitch Siren 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Another theme force you don't see much of. Again warwitch sirens get advance deployment, the heavies get advance deployment. There are arcnodes up the wazoo, warwitch sirens to run all the jacks, two pistol wraiths to combine with the warwitch sirens and crippling grasp and the feat to ensure your opponent can never do anything. I really like it and I really like to see a good jack heavy cryx army. From Scotts comments this list is designed to take a colossal out of the game, make sure it can never do anything without necessarily killing it.
Lich Lord Terminus -4
Necrosurgeon & 3 Stitch Thralls 2
Necrosurgeon & 3 Stitch Thralls 2
Satyxis Blood Witches (Leader and 9 Grunts) 6
Satyxis Blood Hag 2
The Withershadow Combine 5
Gorman di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist 2
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Ragman 2
Saxon Orrik 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Not a standard terminus build. You still have the full unit of mechthralls and double necrosurgeons so you still get the tough recycling machanithralls but it only has one full unit then blood witches, the hag in particular is a big help on Terminus feat turn to ensure the maximum amount of souls. Withershadow for the free upkeep of Malediction. Then there is pathfinder from Saxon some fixers in Ragman and Gorman and the Warwitch Siren to run the Kraken (as sad as that sounds) it can get 3 focus on feat turn pretty easily. The Krakken is a good partner for Terminus because it is so beefy. You need the same things to kill the Krakken as you need to kill Terminus so if you can trade the Krakken for those models then there is nothing left that can kill Terminus and you win.
I have not listened to Chain Attacks review of the cup yet so I may update this after I've gone through that.
Tier 4 Shore Leave
Pirate Queen Skarre -6
- Harrower 10
- Leviathan 9
- Skarlock Thrall 2
Bloodgorgers (Leader and 9 Grunts) 8
Satyxis Raiders (Leader and 5 Grunts) 5
Satyxis Raiders (Leader and 5 Grunts) 5
General Gerlak Slaughterborn 3
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Satyxis Raider Captain 2
Satyxis Raider Captain 2
This is an interesting theme fore, the Harrower and Leviathan get advance deployment, the Bloodgorgers get advance move and the Satyxis already have advance deployment and are stupid fast. This list gets up in your face fast and then Skarre feats you to death. I really like it and I'm surprised more people don't play this theme force. I suppose last year jam wasn't as powerful as it is this year.
Tier 4 Witching Hour
Warwitch Deneghra -5
- Nightwretch 4
- Ripjaw (free)
- Ripjaw 5
- Scavenger 4
- Stalker 4
- Harrower 10
- Harrower 10
- Skarlock Thrall 2
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Pistol Wraith 3
Pistol Wraith 3
Warwitch Siren 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Another theme force you don't see much of. Again warwitch sirens get advance deployment, the heavies get advance deployment. There are arcnodes up the wazoo, warwitch sirens to run all the jacks, two pistol wraiths to combine with the warwitch sirens and crippling grasp and the feat to ensure your opponent can never do anything. I really like it and I really like to see a good jack heavy cryx army. From Scotts comments this list is designed to take a colossal out of the game, make sure it can never do anything without necessarily killing it.
Lich Lord Terminus -4
- Kraken 19
- Skarlock Thrall 2
Necrosurgeon & 3 Stitch Thralls 2
Necrosurgeon & 3 Stitch Thralls 2
Satyxis Blood Witches (Leader and 9 Grunts) 6
Satyxis Blood Hag 2
The Withershadow Combine 5
Gorman di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist 2
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Necrotech & 1 Scrap Thrall 1
Ragman 2
Saxon Orrik 2
Warwitch Siren 2
Not a standard terminus build. You still have the full unit of mechthralls and double necrosurgeons so you still get the tough recycling machanithralls but it only has one full unit then blood witches, the hag in particular is a big help on Terminus feat turn to ensure the maximum amount of souls. Withershadow for the free upkeep of Malediction. Then there is pathfinder from Saxon some fixers in Ragman and Gorman and the Warwitch Siren to run the Kraken (as sad as that sounds) it can get 3 focus on feat turn pretty easily. The Krakken is a good partner for Terminus because it is so beefy. You need the same things to kill the Krakken as you need to kill Terminus so if you can trade the Krakken for those models then there is nothing left that can kill Terminus and you win.
I have not listened to Chain Attacks review of the cup yet so I may update this after I've gone through that.
Thursday, March 21, 2013
More Convergence Spoilers
This weeks spoiler insider is all about convergence jacks. I am going to say go read it there. I will mention that the ability of the diffuser is essentially hunters mark and that quake for those who don't play cygnar requires a direct hit against an enemy model to knock down everything in the AOE. True Sight is what gun mages have, you ignore, concealment, camouflage and stealth.
Wednesday, March 20, 2013
Mayhem Cup - WIll Pagani
Mayhem Cup data is up on End Game Gaming (I love that site) and as usual I will talk about the winning lists, especially as one of the winning lists was Morvhanna2.
Morvahna the Dawnshadow
* Warpwolf Stalker
* Warpwolf Stalker
* Gorax
Warpborn Skinwalkers Max
* Warpborn Alpha
Wolves of Orboros Max
* Wolves of Orboros Chieftain and Standard
Shifting Stones
* Stone Keeper
Shifting Stones
Wolf Lord Morraig
Gallows Grove
Gallows Grove
The wolves are probably the thing that would throw people about this list but with powerful charge they are MAT 8 so they go to MAT 10 with Carnivore. They are a great cheap unit to help you trigger imperishable conviction. With her feat you guarantee that you can use power swell. Damage rerolls can really help when you have 4 dice and with concealment they are DEF 15 against ranged attacks. The Skinwalkers are a more obvious choice, you bring them back with all their wounds. Double Stalker and Gorax is a pretty standard self contained package as a battle group. You don't need any other support and with Scales of Fate you can make sure you trigger sprint. Both Stalkers also get stealth from Fog of War. Wolf Lord Morraig also gets stealth from fog of war and flanks with the wolves of Orboros. With his speed he can get a lot of work done. Gallows Groves are a must particularly as you can bring them back to wherever you need with the feat.
Kromac the Ravenous
* Ghetorix
* Warpwolf Stalker
* Feral Warpwolf
* Gorax
* Druid Wilder
Druid Stoneward and Woldstalkers
Druid Stoneward and Woldstalkers
Shifting Stones
* Stone Keeper
Shifting Stones
Gallows Grove
Gallows Grove
Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew
Morvahna the Dawnshadow
* Warpwolf Stalker
* Warpwolf Stalker
* Gorax
Warpborn Skinwalkers Max
* Warpborn Alpha
Wolves of Orboros Max
* Wolves of Orboros Chieftain and Standard
Shifting Stones
* Stone Keeper
Shifting Stones
Wolf Lord Morraig
Gallows Grove
Gallows Grove
The wolves are probably the thing that would throw people about this list but with powerful charge they are MAT 8 so they go to MAT 10 with Carnivore. They are a great cheap unit to help you trigger imperishable conviction. With her feat you guarantee that you can use power swell. Damage rerolls can really help when you have 4 dice and with concealment they are DEF 15 against ranged attacks. The Skinwalkers are a more obvious choice, you bring them back with all their wounds. Double Stalker and Gorax is a pretty standard self contained package as a battle group. You don't need any other support and with Scales of Fate you can make sure you trigger sprint. Both Stalkers also get stealth from Fog of War. Wolf Lord Morraig also gets stealth from fog of war and flanks with the wolves of Orboros. With his speed he can get a lot of work done. Gallows Groves are a must particularly as you can bring them back to wherever you need with the feat.
Kromac the Ravenous
* Ghetorix
* Warpwolf Stalker
* Feral Warpwolf
* Gorax
* Druid Wilder
Druid Stoneward and Woldstalkers
Druid Stoneward and Woldstalkers
Shifting Stones
* Stone Keeper
Shifting Stones
Gallows Grove
Gallows Grove
Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew
This list is pretty standard Kromac. Hit an run using lightning strike and warpath and using the tankyness of the Feral and Stalker. Be interesting to see if the Feral stays in this list when the new Satyr is released.
The fact that you can play this pairing is almost enough to make me pick up circle. It doesn't help that I always like Will's lists. I think it says a lot about Morvhanna2 that the week she was released she was one of the winning lists at a very large tournament (Mayhem had 100+ players). This by the way is the tournament my tournament is based on.
Convergence Spoilers
I might put them all together at some point for now:
Circumpotence: Enemy models currently in Axis’ control area suffer minus 2 SPD and STR. and Friendly faction models currently in axis’ control area gain plus 2 SPD and STR. Circumpotence lasts for one round.
Feat for Axis the Harmonic Enforcer. Great feat, speed penalties are brutal, especially against infantry.
Circumpotence: Enemy models currently in Axis’ control area suffer minus 2 SPD and STR. and Friendly faction models currently in axis’ control area gain plus 2 SPD and STR. Circumpotence lasts for one round.
Feat for Axis the Harmonic Enforcer. Great feat, speed penalties are brutal, especially against infantry.
Mangled Metal Update
Just a quick one for the upcoming Mangled Metal - spells and abilities that generate models still work the same, it's just that your list must only include warjacks or warbeasts so Goreshade gets his feat. My list for those wondering is:
Legion of Everblight
Standard Army
PCs: 25 / 25
6 models
[00] Vayl, Consul of Everblight (0 / 6 WB)
[09] >> Scythean
[09] >> Angelius
[09] >> Angelius
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
Legion of Everblight
Standard Army
PCs: 25 / 25
6 models
[00] Vayl, Consul of Everblight (0 / 6 WB)
[09] >> Scythean
[09] >> Angelius
[09] >> Angelius
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
It's not the greatest mangled metal list in existance but it's solid and I want more practice with Vayl2. The thing I need to improve is predicting where my opponents models need to go so that my angels can be in threat of that area but out of threat of models with greater than 12" threat.
Friday, March 15, 2013
Domination Review
Everyone is reviewing Gargantuans and I gave some quick thoughts on it. One thing I want to do though is go back and have a look at the last hordes release Domination and have a look at the long term impact of the stuff from that book now that it has actually had time to settle into the meta. Try and compare that to my initial thoughts and the thoughts of the community.
Trolls
Jarl - While not top tier Jarl has proven to be good, better than I initially gave him credit for and is a legitimate part of a competitive list pairing. He was also not well liked by the community to begin with.
Grissel2 - I always thought she would be solid just because of her massive ranged output but the forums did not like her. Not as good as Jarl she is a solid caster and tournament worthy.
Storm Troll - Has not seen much play, it's good but it's a support light and as such is competing against a very strong field of support lights. He has not proved to be as good as originally thought.
ScattergunnerUA - The best of the troll releases, it brought scattergunners into competitive, tournament level lists.
Rok - Not as good as I thought he would be, playtesting has shown that primal on trolls isn't quite as good as it is in circle where you can engineer a lot more angles and shenanigans. Trolls tend to rely on their beasts surviving and Rok himself struggles because of lack of reach.
Sons Of Bragg - Break into some competitive lists but not enough for the fact that they are characters to matter.
War Wagon - One of the better battle engines, solid if unspectacular. It makes some lists.
As a whole - nothing really changed the way trolls play, just more options for stuff trolls could already do. Primal was probably the big let down, I think a lot of people were full of ideas for Primal and it's just not as good as in circle. I think it also doesn't help that it's on an 11 point heavy without reach.
Circle
Grayle - Has not broken into competitive play. He is simply below the power curve, there are better options for whatever you want to do in circle. While first impressions on the caster were not great they were still probably better than he turned out to be.
Baldur2 - Has broken into competitive play but not circle's top tier. His armour stacking ability is good and his ability to do work himself gives him a strong mid to late game. I liked him from the start but there were mixed reviews from circle people in general.
Skarsfell Griffon - Another release that has proven to be not worth it.
Winter Argus - After being thoroughly crapped on early in the release cycle (including by me, I didn't give it a lot of credit) circle players have found a fair amount of use for this guy because he is so hard to kill. He requires a lot more resources to remove than most people want to spend on a 5 point model.
Ghettorix - Has proven to be amazing, he tanks really well and deals out a lot of damage, reach really helps. You are pretty much guaranteed to see him in one of the two lists any circle player brings to a tournament. He has proven to be a lot better than early opinion had him to be.
Gallows Groves - Changed the game for circle and continue to be auto includes for their new caster in Gargantuans. They were considered amazing from the start and are amazing.
Celestial Fulcrum - One of the best of the Battle Engines, it's ability to remove infantry makes it a terrifying prospect but it is hampered by predeployment rules and the rise of colossals. Still it makes lists.
As a whole - Circle really stepped up it's game, as a faction it gets a lot more out of offensive spells and really improved it's ability to be able to take a hit. Circle did really well out of Domination.
Skorne
Naaresh - A solid caster, iron flesh is a very powerful spell and does do a lot for Skorne.
Hexeris2 - A top tier caster for sure and he continues to be helped out by new releases. You will see him in almost all Skorne list pairings because of his ability to deal with problem match ups for the rest of the faction.
Raider - A light with a utility animus, you didn't see it much initially but it's come roaring into lists along with proxy Mammoths. It will see top level play.
Slingers - Giving skorne a cheap ranged option has really helped the faction, as a utility unit you don't see them everywhere but they do pop up.
Archidon - Sprint in skorne is fantastic, it allows Molik Karn to do his thing without using his own fury on fate walker. Thanks to how great the first two Makedas are with him this beast has seen a lot of play. It can do some work itself, 4 fury and crit pitch are decent for 7 points.
Tiberion - Fantastic and in very list pairing. He's almost a colossal himself (and rumour is was used to get a feel for how good/bad colossal rules would be).
Siege Animantarax - Despite a lot of people trying to champion this terrible model it remains terrible.
As a Whole - Skorne got a lot of help dealing with their problem match ups and began the transition (completed in Gargantuans) to a combined arms faction.
Legion
Kallus - A strong option and gave Legion a good caster for infantry however he struggles to see tournament time due to the strength of Legion's top tier.
Vayl2 - The best model in the book Vayl2 has proven to be one of the better casters in the game. Her theme force in particular is amazing.
Naga - Giving legion blessed instantly fixed legions problem with ARM and particularly with Menoth. Haley2 now needs to fear the legion match up. The Naga has been massive for Legion.
Succubus - Another boon for legion, the faction can now juggle buffs and spam animuses. It really improved Lylyth2.
Proteus - I'm not sure any model in this book received more playtesting without a worthwhile result. It's the mountain king of Domination. Maybe worse.
Farrilor - Actually a really good model but Legionnaires are used because they are cheap, he's the same cost as half a full unit. Makes it hard to take him especially when a lot of the times when I take Legionnaires I kill a few myself in order to make a shredder.
Throne of Everblight - My throne has seen a lot of game time though I have not taken it to a tournament. It's great on both Thagroshes and gives Legion some help clearing infantry.
As a Whole - In hindsight Legion won the book. Blessed and the ability to spam it, one of the best casters in the game and some solid options that really add to a lot of lists really helped out Legion. Skorne I think could be counted as winning if you also took into account how these releases help gargantuans but I think in the end you count that towards that book.
Trolls
Jarl - While not top tier Jarl has proven to be good, better than I initially gave him credit for and is a legitimate part of a competitive list pairing. He was also not well liked by the community to begin with.
Grissel2 - I always thought she would be solid just because of her massive ranged output but the forums did not like her. Not as good as Jarl she is a solid caster and tournament worthy.
Storm Troll - Has not seen much play, it's good but it's a support light and as such is competing against a very strong field of support lights. He has not proved to be as good as originally thought.
ScattergunnerUA - The best of the troll releases, it brought scattergunners into competitive, tournament level lists.
Rok - Not as good as I thought he would be, playtesting has shown that primal on trolls isn't quite as good as it is in circle where you can engineer a lot more angles and shenanigans. Trolls tend to rely on their beasts surviving and Rok himself struggles because of lack of reach.
Sons Of Bragg - Break into some competitive lists but not enough for the fact that they are characters to matter.
War Wagon - One of the better battle engines, solid if unspectacular. It makes some lists.
As a whole - nothing really changed the way trolls play, just more options for stuff trolls could already do. Primal was probably the big let down, I think a lot of people were full of ideas for Primal and it's just not as good as in circle. I think it also doesn't help that it's on an 11 point heavy without reach.
Circle
Grayle - Has not broken into competitive play. He is simply below the power curve, there are better options for whatever you want to do in circle. While first impressions on the caster were not great they were still probably better than he turned out to be.
Baldur2 - Has broken into competitive play but not circle's top tier. His armour stacking ability is good and his ability to do work himself gives him a strong mid to late game. I liked him from the start but there were mixed reviews from circle people in general.
Skarsfell Griffon - Another release that has proven to be not worth it.
Winter Argus - After being thoroughly crapped on early in the release cycle (including by me, I didn't give it a lot of credit) circle players have found a fair amount of use for this guy because he is so hard to kill. He requires a lot more resources to remove than most people want to spend on a 5 point model.
Ghettorix - Has proven to be amazing, he tanks really well and deals out a lot of damage, reach really helps. You are pretty much guaranteed to see him in one of the two lists any circle player brings to a tournament. He has proven to be a lot better than early opinion had him to be.
Gallows Groves - Changed the game for circle and continue to be auto includes for their new caster in Gargantuans. They were considered amazing from the start and are amazing.
Celestial Fulcrum - One of the best of the Battle Engines, it's ability to remove infantry makes it a terrifying prospect but it is hampered by predeployment rules and the rise of colossals. Still it makes lists.
As a whole - Circle really stepped up it's game, as a faction it gets a lot more out of offensive spells and really improved it's ability to be able to take a hit. Circle did really well out of Domination.
Skorne
Naaresh - A solid caster, iron flesh is a very powerful spell and does do a lot for Skorne.
Hexeris2 - A top tier caster for sure and he continues to be helped out by new releases. You will see him in almost all Skorne list pairings because of his ability to deal with problem match ups for the rest of the faction.
Raider - A light with a utility animus, you didn't see it much initially but it's come roaring into lists along with proxy Mammoths. It will see top level play.
Slingers - Giving skorne a cheap ranged option has really helped the faction, as a utility unit you don't see them everywhere but they do pop up.
Archidon - Sprint in skorne is fantastic, it allows Molik Karn to do his thing without using his own fury on fate walker. Thanks to how great the first two Makedas are with him this beast has seen a lot of play. It can do some work itself, 4 fury and crit pitch are decent for 7 points.
Tiberion - Fantastic and in very list pairing. He's almost a colossal himself (and rumour is was used to get a feel for how good/bad colossal rules would be).
Siege Animantarax - Despite a lot of people trying to champion this terrible model it remains terrible.
As a Whole - Skorne got a lot of help dealing with their problem match ups and began the transition (completed in Gargantuans) to a combined arms faction.
Legion
Kallus - A strong option and gave Legion a good caster for infantry however he struggles to see tournament time due to the strength of Legion's top tier.
Vayl2 - The best model in the book Vayl2 has proven to be one of the better casters in the game. Her theme force in particular is amazing.
Naga - Giving legion blessed instantly fixed legions problem with ARM and particularly with Menoth. Haley2 now needs to fear the legion match up. The Naga has been massive for Legion.
Succubus - Another boon for legion, the faction can now juggle buffs and spam animuses. It really improved Lylyth2.
Proteus - I'm not sure any model in this book received more playtesting without a worthwhile result. It's the mountain king of Domination. Maybe worse.
Farrilor - Actually a really good model but Legionnaires are used because they are cheap, he's the same cost as half a full unit. Makes it hard to take him especially when a lot of the times when I take Legionnaires I kill a few myself in order to make a shredder.
Throne of Everblight - My throne has seen a lot of game time though I have not taken it to a tournament. It's great on both Thagroshes and gives Legion some help clearing infantry.
As a Whole - In hindsight Legion won the book. Blessed and the ability to spam it, one of the best casters in the game and some solid options that really add to a lot of lists really helped out Legion. Skorne I think could be counted as winning if you also took into account how these releases help gargantuans but I think in the end you count that towards that book.
Thursday, March 14, 2013
Gargantuans Thoughts
On unreleased stuff:
Trolls
Grim2 - I like him. He has a solid deck of utility spells and mortality which is incredible (but might require bonegrinders, I like them with trolls anyway because we really need certain animuses). Feat again is utility. Mirage is an under appreciated spell.
Night Troll - At MAT 5 P+S 12 he's not going to be tearing stuff up but his animus is interesting and paralysis is awesome against hordes. I am distinctly meh. He's another utility beast, in the right situation he will be amazing but not for every list.
Fennblade Kithkar - Is pretty good for two points. He's competeing with a lot of awesome troll solos for that slot though. To support fennblades I'd take the chronicler ahead of him but as a two point beatstick with vengeance (freindly faction) he will make quite a few lists.
Trollkin Sorceror - Immediatly made a bunch of lists just becasue he costs one point. It's a unit attachment that doesn't use up a unit attachment slot and it brings a decent gun and the ability to remove enemy upkeeps so it's definetely worth taking. Trolls do have a problem with cryx and tend to have to make lists specifically against cryx, this guy helps you do that.
Warders - OK they are not as good as champions but they are two points cheaper. They also have reach. Battle driven is also fairly useful. They are straight into my Madrak2 list.
Circle
Morvhana2 - She's flat out amazing. Purification is incredible Scales of Fate and her feat pair really well with Carnivore and Imperishable Conviction. Fog of War is fantastic in Circle and her feat is stupid. She will see a lot of top level play.
Morvhana2 - She's flat out amazing. Purification is incredible Scales of Fate and her feat pair really well with Carnivore and Imperishable Conviction. Fog of War is fantastic in Circle and her feat is stupid. She will see a lot of top level play.
Razorwing Griffon - not much to say here. Remains to be seen how much an amuck trample will hurt a unit of infantry. Doesn't cost much and it flies and slams so you can't complain.
Riphorn Satyr - 3 initials with a chain attack (for the fists) is not bad, bulldoze is a great animus (like circle needed more movement shenanigans), aggressive makes him essentially fury 5. Got to have a way to buff his P+S but otherwise he looks solid.
Tharn Blood Pack - The Bloodtrackers never became a true combined arms unit, these guys may but I'm not convinced.
Legion
Nephilim Bloodseer - Interesting animus and telemetry and primal magic are really good. He's already in my Bethayne and Lylyth1 lists.
Beast Mistress - She has energizer and field marshall - Aggressive. She's amazing. Just got to figure out who to take her with. Lylyth1? Rhyas? She will see play.
Skorne
Makada3 - Her feat is bonkers amazing, her spell list is meh. She really wants to play forward, really far forwards. With two shield guards in her unit and battle driven and her spell list she will obliterate anything she touches but I'm not sure how well she'll be kept alive. I think she has a lot of promise with her feat and standing back casting animuses and then having a very strong end game (or at least middle to end game as you need some beasts alive).
Despoiler - Is great, especially with Mordikaar
Reptile Hounds - Lessers with take down aren't bad, they really need that flank though and they have to spend a fury to get take down. They are SPD 7 though.
Incendiarii - best medium based shooting unit in the game.
Minions
Midas - Curse [bone grinders] is surely a troll. Battle lust, calamity and hex blast (and bad blood) is a pretty damn good spell list for making stuff dead. His feat is interesting, as is butchery. In the end though he's not Rask.
Razor Boars are the only new minion beasts? Seriously?
Gobber Tinker - 1 point and can repair hordes battle engines. Can also repair warjacks and battle engines of the warmachine factions. Plus he has a cool little wagon and hat. I like him.
Bog Trog Shamblers - It's Alexia for minions. And Rask removes 1 (just one) whenever he dies and keeps on living because Rask wasn't good enough.
So who won the book? Rask. He's my new faction. Holy crap is he amazing. Skorne and circle also got some really good stuff (though Skornes is better). Trolls actually should be pretty happy but you probably want to stay away from the troll forums if you want to keep your sanity intact. I like that minions got a solo that they cannot use.
Tuesday, March 12, 2013
Tempest Blazers
The Cygnar Gun Mage Cav are being released shortly and are in the new NQ. Quick rundown of inportant stats:
SPD: 9
RAT: 7
DEF: 14
ARM: 13
There is a query on their range (NQ and the card are printed differently so it's either 12" or 10", 12" would be amazing). Their guns are POW10, they have gunfighter and pathfinder. They have 3 shot types:
Blessed (ignores spells that add to DEF or ARM)
Brutal Damage (3 dice damage, not crit brutal, it's always 3 dice)
Electro Leap (nearest model within 4" of target also takes a POW 10)
Blessed we knew from the product blurb, brutal damage I expected, electro leap though I did not expect and it is amazing. Cygnar is full of ways to buff RAT and they start at 7. Being able to output 10 POW 10s and be 15" or 17" away is incredible. Stack their high DEF with blur and you won't ever kill them. Snipe and they are even further away. First thought was Haley1, with Temporal Barrier up you can't even run towards them (not that you'd make it anyway) and +2 to hit will just let them carve up everything. They are so self sufficient that they can go with any caster. They look like a fantastic flanking force and they don't need a great deal of help to lower ARM casters. Run up a ranger or staying on the Haley1 theme catch them in Temporal Barrier and a lot of casters/warlock really don't like being hit by 5 boosted POW 10s.
I am excited. They may make it into my Caine1 list, I'm re-writing that as in 2013 a lot of scenarios have two scoring areas. Stormwall can only contest one so I lost a lot of scenario points. I'd consider them strongly with Nemo2 if I wasn't so enamoured with his theme force. With all his jacks he cracks ARM just fine but a flanking force of light cav with polarity shield would provide a very different threat, and their SPD lets me make sure they are always fighting the things I want them to be fighting. The Strykers can probably use a strong flanking force and it adds some mobility to Darius with double stormwall.
I am excited. They may make it into my Caine1 list, I'm re-writing that as in 2013 a lot of scenarios have two scoring areas. Stormwall can only contest one so I lost a lot of scenario points. I'd consider them strongly with Nemo2 if I wasn't so enamoured with his theme force. With all his jacks he cracks ARM just fine but a flanking force of light cav with polarity shield would provide a very different threat, and their SPD lets me make sure they are always fighting the things I want them to be fighting. The Strykers can probably use a strong flanking force and it adds some mobility to Darius with double stormwall.
Monday, March 11, 2013
Meta Bender - Asphixious2
What's the Problem?
- 20+ weapon masters with good P+S, of those 10 have reach + vengeance + ghostly and 12 have dark shroud and tough and stand up for free and stealth. One is Tartarus. After you kill them 10 get to come back and attack you again. Including Tartarus. Who still gets to use all of his abilities like curse and he creates more banes because there weren't enough. You can also bring back the Sea Hag so you have no tough. Parasite on top of that means there is nothing in this game he cannot remove from the table at will.
- Excarnated bile thralls. Not only do you have to deal with bile thralls but new ones are created from your own dead guys and placed in range while the bulk of the unit hides in safety. Bile thralls purge and kill all your infantry.
- Soul Reaper - he always has more than 7 focus, and he can place his soul gathering template in the best place possible, excarnate a bile thrall, parasite a heavy/colossal and then teleport away to safety.
- He can place clouds to block LOS to anything you want to kill, these clouds auto kill single wound infantry.
- The clouds, combined with teleport, combined with hellmouth (can't charge asphixious and 5" from him is all rough terrain) combined with his excellent stats and any focus he doesn't spend pushing his ARM up and Wrathe often being around so all living models are -2 damage (he lets stuff move extra on feat turn as well) makes asphixious almost invincible.
With his feat not only will asphixious kill anything you love but he can always clear a zone and he has no problem dominating being one of the most difficult models to kill in the entire game. This means that if Ashpixious can get to 2-3 control points without using his feat (just applying a buttload of weapon masters and excarnated bile thralls) he pretty much automatically wins. He can also use the feat to get ahead and put a lot of pressure on his opponent. He generally only needs to be able to dominate once more to win the game.
He also creates a situation where he has so much infantry on the table that if you don't have a lot of infantry clearing you will just be overwhelmed. He has no problem cracking ARM so a lot of low model count armies find they just cannot remove enough banes. High model count armies often find themselves bane purged and death knelled to peices.
How to Deal
Don't let him assassinate you with the feat, keep your caster safe, distance is your friend (but really you can't be far enough away to be 100% safe, use terrain and use models that cannot be killed by a single Bane.
The feat requires you to charge so abilities or spells that target your own models and prevent them from charging completely protect them from the feat. Those abilities also provide fairly decent protection from Banes.
Don't ever just kill one Bane Knight. Wipe out the whole unit or don't touch them.
Attacks that remove from play are your friend. If you remove a model from play it does not come back on feat turn. Tartarus should be your main target for this followed by the Bane Knights (and the Blood Hag). Tartarus makes the feat particularly deadly, his ability to thresher with reach and curse is a big part of the feat.
You need to be able to remove a lot of infantry. There will be 40+ models on the table. You can shut down the excarnate bile thrall trick with magic denial or by targetting the bile thrall unit with an ability that prevents special attacks. You also want a list that can't be taken off the table by 10 MAT 8 P+S 13 chargin weaponmasters. You almost certainly want to avoid a colossal.
Caster Recomendations
Cygnar - Haley1. No charging within 16" of her means he has no feat. It also means that those fantastic weaponmasters need to slowly slog it up the table through covering fire templates and a hail of gun mage shots. You should always win this match. Just be careful to camps some focus when Asphixious manages to get some extra focus from his soul reaper otherwise he will just excarnate you to death. Other than her Haley2 often has a decent game, the feat shuts him down for a turn and again he will only kill a Stormwall with the feat. Arcane shielded Centurions are spectacular at holding zones (just watch out for slams from his arc nodes). Caine2 will RFP all the Bane Knights and Banes like killing heavies not trying to wade through super tough - no knock down Boomhowlers. Cygnar really doesn't care about this match up, the faction is full of answers.
Legion - Lylyth2 has enough AOEs that set everything on fire and stop infantry advacing to chew through the infantry here. Saeryn is full of answers. Vayl2 has options and Thagrosh2 will at least give you a game.
Trollbloods - Grissel1 is generally the one you want to go to. Grim Angus has game too. Madrak2 will take all that infantry off the table without difficulty and even Asphixious cannot assassinate him.
Menoth - Harbinger can handle the match, fear of god, her feat and her own excellent scenario abilities make her a decent match up for the litch. High Reclaimer shuts down charging thanks to his clouds and has Ashes to clear up infantry. This match up can be trouble for menoth however you can battle your jacks every turn which allows you to do a fair amount of damage with redeemer templates.
Minions - :( Rask is probably the best minions can do.
Mercenaries - MacBain has some game, as does Fiona and Shae. The dwarf casters make a game of it but only if you take them outside of Searforge.
Sunday, March 10, 2013
Tournament Talk
I want to skim over a lot of things in this post.
First - There are quite a few people excited about the club challenge I want to run. It looks like we may even have a team from Melbourne coming up. If we get a team from Melbourne and do not get a team from the Guild I WILL MURDER ALL OF YOU.
Results - Due to the odd number of players and results kind of working the tournament should have finished a round early however we played the last round anyway. This left me on at that stage 3 wins 1 loss playing Jeff Traish on 4 wins and no losses. I won that game leaving 3 players on 4 wins and 1 loss. Me, Jeff and Creagh. The first tie breaker was strength of schedule (how well your opponents had done), since we had all played each other it came down the other guys. I picked up 3rd, Creagh 1st. Didn't play Haley2, first time I'm sad that didn't happen. I wanted to live the dream and kill her on her feat turn.
About the meta - Not nearly as many colossals as I expected. No stormwalls. None. There was a Mountain King, Two Krakkens, Hyperion and a Conquest. No Galleons but no Merc players which is generally the way (no minions either, it's usually either one or none for those factions). More warmachine than hordes, infantry machine is alive and well, the doomshaper1 theme force and the Vayl2 theme forces are good. They took second and third. Menoth are a strong faction. Guns are still a thing, expect to see guns. The scenarios are very winnable and if your opponent can't jam you, you almost always want to go second. No one was jamming, I did have a ret player jam me with quickened halberdiers but that was after they had killed three Legionnairres so copped almost a full vengeance. That also allowed me to spawn and then refill the pot. The spawning vessel is ridiculous for 3 points.
About my tournament pairing - By this I mean my competitive super series invitational (essentially the Australian Warmachine Weekend or national championship) lists because I'm still going to screw around with stupid lists and caster combinations for everything else. Last year it was Saeryn and Lylyth2. After seeing how good Vayl2 is I think I want to include her. I don't know who I'd pair her with. Lylyth2 eats Haley double stormwall and Bart Galleon as well as the protectorate gunline and Saeryn does pretty well against Asphixious2 and Cryx in general, as well as Trolls and Skorne. Vayl2 has game against everyone which is great but makes it more difficult to think of a good pair for her. I could always go Mercs and take Bart Galleon and pair with Damiano, Ashlynn or Shae. EDIT: Just spent some time going over all my lists and I am feeling Vayl1/Vayl2. Super series is in May btw so some time next month expect to be saying a lot of Vayl.
About Colossals/Gargantuans - I played 4 games against colossals, two in the tournament proper and two in my practice games in the week leading up. I destroyed only one and that was in a practice game, both colossals I faced in the tournament I did not even damage. I won all 4 games. You can't contest all the scoring areas in 2013 with a colossal, if you can't kill a colossal you still have a game. My colossal advice should probably have an addendum - don't get fixated on the colossal. If you get tunnel vision you can throw away opportunities to win. In this list I had no way to minimise the colossals, I just ignored them and killed their caster and/or went for the other scoring area. The colossal needs to predeploy and can't run if it wants to shoot. I would have went after the colossals had I needed to, my list is capable of killing them but as always in this game you prioritise targets based on what will put you ahead on scenario or attrition or to set up an assassination. Always focus on winning not on killing the big scary thing.
Saturday, March 9, 2013
Stupid Mangled Metal Lists
Retribution of Scyrah
Standard Army
PCs: 25 / 25
8 models
[00] Dawnlord Vyros (0 / 6 WJ remaining)
[07] >> Sphinx
[04] >> Aspis
[04] >> Griffon
[04] >> Griffon
[04] >> Griffon
[04] >> Griffon
[04] >> Griffon
Only reason a sphinx is in this list is because another Griffon would make the list 3 points short and therefore illegal. If I had a way to get a hold of these models I would play the shit out of this list.
Legion of Everblight
Standard Army
PCs: 25 / 25
15 models
[00] Thagrosh, the Messiah (0 / 3 WB)
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
[02] >> Shredder
I like that I think I have enough Shredders to run this list. EDIT: I could run this list at 35 points. No, I don't think I have too many shredders.
Mercenaries
Talion Charter
PCs: 25 / 25
7 models
[00] Captain Phinneus Shae (0 / 6 WJ remaining)
[06] >> Nomad
[05] >> Vanguard
[05] >> Vanguard
[05] >> Vanguard
[05] >> Vanguard
[05] >> Vanguard
I am sad that I do not have enough Vanguards to run this list.
Cygnar
Standard Army
PCs: 25 / 25
8 models
[00] General Adept Nemo (0 / 6 WJ remaining)
[07] >> Ironclad
[04] >> Charger
[04] >> Charger
[04] >> Charger
[04] >> Charger
[04] >> Charger
[04] >> Charger
It scares me that I might have enough chargers to run this list.
Protectorate of Menoth
The Northern Crusade (Hierarch Severius)
(Tier 1)
PCs: 24 / 25
7 models
[00] Hierarch Severius (0 / 6 WJ remaining)
[05] >> Crusader
[05] >> Crusader
[05] >> Crusader
[05] >> Crusader
[05] >> Crusader
[05] >> Crusader
Protectorate of Menoth
Judgement of Fire (High Executioner Servath Reznik)
(Tier 1)
PCs: 24 / 25
5 models
[00] High Executioner Servath Reznik (0 / 6 WJ remaining)
[09] >> Scourge of Heresy
[07] >> Reckoner
[07] >> Reckoner
[07] >> Reckoner
This seems almost good. I'm not sure it should be here.
Trollbloods
The Big Bang (Captain Gunnbjorn)
(Tier 1)
PCs: 25 / 25
5 models
[00] Captain Gunnbjorn (0 / 5 WB)
[08] >> Dire Troll Blitzer
[09] >> Dire Troll Bomber
[09] >> Dire Troll Bomber
[04] >> Swamp Troll
There we go. Back to the reason for this list.
Khador
War Host (Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince)
(Tier 1)
PCs: 25 / 25
7 models
[00] Vladimir Tzepesci, the Dark Prince (0 / 5 WJ remaining)
[05] >> Berserker
[05] >> Berserker
[05] >> Berserker
[05] >> Berserker
[05] >> Berserker
[05] >> Berserker
I will play this list if I can get a hold of enough Berserkers.
Etiquette - A Controversial Suggestion
During a tournament game there was a misunderstanding on terrain, my opponent was forgot the discussion we had at the start of the game and moved into a position where he would likely be assassinated if not for the cover bonus the pre-game discussion had precluded a piece of terrain from granting. By the time I realised he thought he had cover it was too late and I decided to let the terrain count as cover.
The thing I find interesting and the reason I'm writing this is that I would not have backed down had it been someone I disliked and I would back down again if a similar thing happened to someone I do like. I think this is the correct tournament etiquette No it's not fair, not even a little bit, but it does ensure I keep a good relationship with the people I want to keep playing with. I'm not disadvantaging people I dislike or out of towners, that's how tournament stuff is supposed to work. All I am doing is playing a bit looser with the people I like because it's a game and in the end I am playing it to have fun. That ensures the best long term outcome for me and in the end I care more about that than winning. In the end it was a lot less of a negative play experience for me than it would have been for my opponent as I was at the start of my turn when we noticed the problem.
Also everyone from Wollongong reading this who is not Harry - You all suck. Come to shit.
The thing I find interesting and the reason I'm writing this is that I would not have backed down had it been someone I disliked and I would back down again if a similar thing happened to someone I do like. I think this is the correct tournament etiquette No it's not fair, not even a little bit, but it does ensure I keep a good relationship with the people I want to keep playing with. I'm not disadvantaging people I dislike or out of towners, that's how tournament stuff is supposed to work. All I am doing is playing a bit looser with the people I like because it's a game and in the end I am playing it to have fun. That ensures the best long term outcome for me and in the end I care more about that than winning. In the end it was a lot less of a negative play experience for me than it would have been for my opponent as I was at the start of my turn when we noticed the problem.
Also everyone from Wollongong reading this who is not Harry - You all suck. Come to shit.
Friday, March 8, 2013
25 Point Mangled Metal at Good Games
http://www.wargamerau.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=149279
Where: Good Games WollongongAnother tournament. This one is in Wollongong so no excuses. Putting together some lists already. So far it's between: Thagrosh1, Lylyth1, Vayl2 and Doomshaper2. I do like Kreoss3 in this format because he personally does a lot of work but I'd need to paint him and two heavies. I also like Stryker2 for similar reasons but he is ruled out for the same problem.
When: Saturday 23 March 2013
Cost: $15
Time: 10am
What: 25pts Mangled Metal/ Tooth and Claw. SO Caster + Jacks/Beasts ONLY. Khador can take a minimum sized Man-O-War Unit as a light jack. Colossal/Gargantuan are a go.
Prizes: Depends on numbers. Raffle with no double dipping. Win = 2 tickets, Loss = 1 ticket, FULLY painted force = 3 tickets, first time to a Wollongong event = 3 tickets, furthest travelled (out of area) = 2 tickets.
Attitude: A sense of humour wanting to roll dice and have FUN!!!
Hope to see you there!
Rumours (Gargantuans)
With the book out within a week rumours are starting to circulate about what is in it. I'll make a half arsed attempt to gather them here:
Legion:
Lesser Warlock. Can only take lesser warbeasts, fury 4, has aggressive (so its lessers charge for free) and flanks with warbeasts it controls. Very interesting for 3 points. The only lesser I pay points for that is not a theme force requirement is a shredder and a massive part of them is their animus. A lot of the time you want them controlled by your warlock for blight bringer and Saeryns feat or manifest destiny or incite or shadow pack. Legion has some great battlegroup spells.
Nephilum (blood) Seer. Can cast another warbeasts animus ala Cyclopes shaman. Animus is witch blight
Skorne:
Character Rhinodon. Eyeless sight. Same animus as the Wodlwyrd (double focus or fury to cast or upkeep spells within 10"). Upkeeps a spell for free, can make void spirits and has an affinity with mordikaar that gives it dark shroud (-2 ARM to stuff in its melee range). Again Skorne just seem to be getting awesome stuff. This seems like exactly what Mordikaar needed.
Reptile Hounds pow 8, 13/13 with 13 hp, slaughterhouse animus, flank [reptile hounds] 2pts a piece. Meh. Two points. Takedown is a pretty useful animus for 2 points. Removes from play and removes tough. You probably need two to get flank off otherwise they won't do much work.
Trolls:
Mugs and Krump are RAT6 with granted abilities: Reform and Circular Vision. Snare Gun and a Blunderbuss.
Troll Warders are spd4, arm 17, with Battle Driven, P+S10 Weapon Master, 8 wounds, and 5/8 point cost (Battle driven- after member of unit is damaged, +2 STR and ARM and pathfinder for one round.)
Partial spell list for Grimm:
Pursuit (offensive lets you move a beast or Grim if the thing you are pursuing moves), Mirage (two inch place for modul unit during the control phase), and Mage Sight (5" AOE, models in it can be targetted by your battle group regardless of stealth, clouds or forests).
Stuff I think is less reliable:New Light Warbeast
Night troll 4 pts, mat 5 defense 12 arm 15. Animus? Beguile - within 5" warrior models must advance directly towards it. Eyeless sight, stealth, man eater, pow 12 claws that cause paralisys (DEF 7 can't run or charge)
Solo
Fennblade Kithkar 2pts MAT 7 ARM 15. unyielding. 8 boxes. Commander, Hard (same as Fenns). Righteous Vengence
Reach, 2 x pow 13
Morvhana - Purification (balls). Also Sunder Spirit (meh) and carnivore (Gators, Skin Walkers, heavies). Heals a point whenever a friendly faction model in CTRL dies.
Points Cost: Ravagers PC 7/10. POW 13 bows. Assault and Battery, Tree Walker, Heart Eater,
New Satyr, Points Cost: 9. Three melee attacks with POW 16, Grab and Smash Animus: Bulldoze (Self)
New Griffon Warbeast. Animus: Amuck (boosted to hit on special attacks). Razor Wings: can trample everything. PC 5.
Thursday, March 7, 2013
Wednesday, March 6, 2013
Meta Benders - Haley2
The meta to give a simple definition is the state of the game. At Guild Gaming and in Wollongong in general there is a very casual meta, the one in Canberra is more competitive. The competitive meta is formed at tournaments, generally ones more competitive than the one I'm attending this weekend (and no one else from the guild is because you all suck). A lot of things shape the Meta, colossals in particular have forced lists to include more options to crack ARM. Iron flesh in early MKII forced people to make sure they could deal with high DEF. Recursion mechanics are also beginning to have an impact on the game and the easily contestable nature of the steamroller package last year made the gunline particularly dominant. More than that though there are particular lists and combinations that shape the competitive meta and I'm going to go through the worst of them and give some basic general advice on how to deal with them.
Lets start with Haley2.
What's The Problem?
- Two Stormwalls, arcane shield and Deceleration - there are a lot of damage boxes and they are protected stacked ARM buffs
- The feat - nothing that needs activation order or melee attacks is going to work for a turn
- Temporal acceleration and the bond - Her bonded stormwall can get to SPD 9 with 3 initial attacks (from the big guns or the fists) it can also get 4 focus. The other one can go to SPD 7 with the same initials and 3 focus which is still insane.
- Covering Fire and Mage Storm. Each stormwall will put down two covering fire templates spaced about an inch apart and then one stormwall will drop a pod on the end. Ryan will then mage storm this pod. With decent spacing you are looking at approximately 20" of the table that you can't enter without taking a POW 12
- Gun mages with deadeye and they also benefit from Deceleration so if you shoot at them they are DEF 17.
She also has some situationally awesome abilities. Set defence makes her DEF 18 on the charge, replication will let her recast offensive spells your opponent casts if they are within her control area (so 18") which occasionally means that she has crippling grasp. She also has domination, telekinesis and time bomb which are spells that are almost broken good and she doesn't need to ever cast them but can in a pinch.
How to Deal
First and most importantly you have to get her to feat early. She needs to use that feat to protect her stuff. If she's able to hold off the feat until she gets the absolute most out of it then you are boned. So get stuff up in her face. Spread out. Don't be afraid to come in waves and make sure your key pieces are protected.
Next you need to be able to crack armour. Seriously crack armour. You also have to be careful about using infantry to do it. POW 12s mean you need to get their ARM up to 19ish before you can start seriously thinking about running a unit through those templates. Multi wound units are slightly less scared.
You need to be able to absorb a stormwall. By that I mean it can't just be able to scalpel out the most important pieces of your army (whether through the big guns or it's stupidly long charge range). You also need to be able to deal with gun mages who don't care about high DEF or stealth.
Caster Recommendations
Cygnar - Caine2 with all the ARM debuffs. It's an infantry heavy list but Caine can remove a Stormwall with his feat, you have no problem killing Ryan and then you can envelop the last colossal. There won't be enough covering fire for all your dudes. You can also arcane shield forge guard and charge them through the covering fire templates. You expose the weakness of this list which is that the concentration of force in two colossals leaves you bereft of the ability to kill swarms of infantry, your rely on the covering fire templates and squishy gun mages. Nemo1 and Nemo2 are options too, Nemo1 can with with a little bit of support scrap a 19 point Stormclad with a 7 point Ironclad which is hilarious to me. Nemo2 is also very fast with his jacks and has one turn of utter devastation that should be able to end a Stormclad.
Legion - It's Lylyth all the way. She's always been my go to girl for Cygnar and she still is. She'll kill the first colossal and half the gun mages before they have fired a shot and then take the second without much difficulty. The Stormwalls cannot shoot back and the gun mages struggle to hurt her beasts. Also Lylyth is really good at killing them. The match up is a nightmare for Haley. Vayl2 is another suggestion. She purifies off arcane shield and her super long range spell assassination will kill Haley dead.
Mercs - Bart Galleon can take a charging Storwall and can fight back pretty strongly and is probably the best match up. MacBain can countermeasures their colossals to stop the covering fire templates but that is difficult. Magnus2 has the feat/counterfeat thing going and can arc Calamity so is an option. It's a hard one for Mercs.
Trollbloods - Doomshaper, either one. With good positioning of the wall from Janissa and use of the feats it's not a huge issue for either caster. Madrak1 can do it too (with the beast brick), Madrak2 struggles unless you have brought long riders with him.
Minions - Poor Barnabas. Long the gator's answer to Cygnar because of his wonderful swamp pits. Unfortunately he can't crack a stormwall to save his life so until colossals stop being so prevalent or Gators get upkeep removal, a damage buff or P+S higher than 17 he's lose a lot of his previous competitiveness. Rask on the other hand is made for this kind of match up. Carver can do it, especially if you take a bunch of warhogs and even Arcadius isn't out of it, his theme force with 7 point warhogs + forced evolution (+ crippling grasp if you are desperate) is pretty nice. The threat ranges are an issue but you probably don't care if you have 7 warhogs (note: my 50 point Arcadius list has 7 warhogs).
I'm too new to Menoth to offer up a discerning opinion but it doesn't seem like a huge problem. You have choir, purification, Eiryss, enliven, Bastions and Vengers, and some really hard hitting jacks. As a cygnar player like the Haley2/Caine2 pairing and playing that Caine2 is my menoth match up.
For the factions I don't play Ret have Ossyan and Vyros2 (with all the light jacks). Skorne have whichever list has the most bronzebacks, Xerxis and Morghoul1 probably preferred but meh. Circle I think are pushing strongly towards Kaya2 with a pureblood being particularly important and it is a great match up if you have Kaya2. Khador do not particularly like this match up, Karchev, Harkevich, Irusk and Vlad3 might have a game, it does depend a lot on a pending infernal ruling concerning crit devastation (which I'm sure will be ruled in Khador's favour or quickly errata'ed). Cryx do not have a good answer. Asphixious2 has some game, his feat allows him to get past the covering fire templates and if he get stuff into melee with a stormwall it disintegrates, he can generally only kill one though and the second one will be a problem. You can play Skarre2 and trade feats but she doesn't have a damage buff and cryx jacks don't hit hard enough. You can probably make a Denny1 list specifically to kill Stormwalls as well.
Even the factions that have a particularly bad time of Haley2 (Cryx, Mercs, Khador, Trollbloods) can beat the match up but you probably have to tech out a list specifically to play against her.
For the factions I don't play Ret have Ossyan and Vyros2 (with all the light jacks). Skorne have whichever list has the most bronzebacks, Xerxis and Morghoul1 probably preferred but meh. Circle I think are pushing strongly towards Kaya2 with a pureblood being particularly important and it is a great match up if you have Kaya2. Khador do not particularly like this match up, Karchev, Harkevich, Irusk and Vlad3 might have a game, it does depend a lot on a pending infernal ruling concerning crit devastation (which I'm sure will be ruled in Khador's favour or quickly errata'ed). Cryx do not have a good answer. Asphixious2 has some game, his feat allows him to get past the covering fire templates and if he get stuff into melee with a stormwall it disintegrates, he can generally only kill one though and the second one will be a problem. You can play Skarre2 and trade feats but she doesn't have a damage buff and cryx jacks don't hit hard enough. You can probably make a Denny1 list specifically to kill Stormwalls as well.
Even the factions that have a particularly bad time of Haley2 (Cryx, Mercs, Khador, Trollbloods) can beat the match up but you probably have to tech out a list specifically to play against her.
Tuesday, March 5, 2013
Podcast Recommendations
So I have quite a few podcasts that I regularly listen to that are warmachine related and I thought I'd put them up here for anyone that is interested. I do a lot of driving for work and I also like to listen to podcasts while I paint so I'm always on the lookout for good podcasts but I do have to gel with the hosts. The following are highly recommended for anyone who likes to listen to people crap on while they are doing something.
Chain Attack.
Chain attack is probably the best warmachine and hordes podcast around. Lots of information, great production values and they have a very informative format. They also crack me up. In particular I have a giant man-crush on Jay. As a warning there is a lot of Cygnar hate on this podcast from the other two hosts Scott and Trevor.
Muse on Minis
Muse hosts the next two podcasts I am going to talk about as well. Keith in particular has a very similar playstyle to me and his advice has been a huge help in me moving from an assassination focussed playstyle to a more attrition based one. This podcast is maybe 50% warmachine content and 50% trolling the other muse podcasts and the PP forums and the other hosts on this podcast.
Crippled System
Sometimes the hosts on crippled system actually talk about warmachine. This one is definitely the bluest of the podcasts I am recommending and definitely one of my favourites. I love these guys (and Katie). It's a very enjoyable listen and pretty funny just don't expect on topic discussion.
Road to War
A podcast by the Texas Renegades. Much more on topic and warmachine related than Crippled System or Muse on Minis. Will Pagani is another player I find I can just put one of his lists on the table and play it. I had been hoping to see more Legion lists from him but it looks like he is going back to circle.
Other recomendations:
I still enjoy Boosted Damage but their release schedule is pretty erratic, they have not put out a podcast since Christmas. They are or at least have been more painting focussed of late. There is also Epic Flail (or Epic FM I'm not sure which one they prefer) they are pretty new. They are also hosted on Muse On Minis but do not have a dedicated podcast page in what I am pretty sure is a deliberate act of trolling. UPDATE: They have one now, link updated.
Chain Attack.
Chain attack is probably the best warmachine and hordes podcast around. Lots of information, great production values and they have a very informative format. They also crack me up. In particular I have a giant man-crush on Jay. As a warning there is a lot of Cygnar hate on this podcast from the other two hosts Scott and Trevor.
Muse on Minis
Muse hosts the next two podcasts I am going to talk about as well. Keith in particular has a very similar playstyle to me and his advice has been a huge help in me moving from an assassination focussed playstyle to a more attrition based one. This podcast is maybe 50% warmachine content and 50% trolling the other muse podcasts and the PP forums and the other hosts on this podcast.
Crippled System
Sometimes the hosts on crippled system actually talk about warmachine. This one is definitely the bluest of the podcasts I am recommending and definitely one of my favourites. I love these guys (and Katie). It's a very enjoyable listen and pretty funny just don't expect on topic discussion.
Road to War
A podcast by the Texas Renegades. Much more on topic and warmachine related than Crippled System or Muse on Minis. Will Pagani is another player I find I can just put one of his lists on the table and play it. I had been hoping to see more Legion lists from him but it looks like he is going back to circle.
Other recomendations:
I still enjoy Boosted Damage but their release schedule is pretty erratic, they have not put out a podcast since Christmas. They are or at least have been more painting focussed of late. There is also Epic Flail (or Epic FM I'm not sure which one they prefer) they are pretty new. They are also hosted on Muse On Minis but do not have a dedicated podcast page in what I am pretty sure is a deliberate act of trolling. UPDATE: They have one now, link updated.
Monday, March 4, 2013
Grim's Feat
Feat: On My Mark
While in Grimʼs control area, friendly Faction models gain Mark Target
and friendly Faction modelsʼ ranged weapons gain Snipe. On My Mark lasts
for one turn. (Other friendly Faction models gain +2 to ranged attack
rolls against enemy models within 5 ̋ of a model with Mark Target that
are in its LOS.) (Ranged weapons with Snipe gain +4 RNG).
You might already be aware of this one. It was spoiled on the forums but not having an official source (and not being particularly exciting) I didn't put it up here. The feat has a little bit of skornegy, snipe gives you extra range but mark the target requires you to be close to your opponent. In general it's not going to be a problem, you take Burrowers or Fennblades and you have a unit that it going to be way ahead of the rest of your army anyway. The other issue is that trolls already pay a snipe tax, The Impaler, Swamp, Slag, Pyre and Bomber are all range 8. The troll ranged units generally kind of suck. The Scattergunners and Scouts are at least solid units and the Scattergunners might get the most out of this feat with clear and sprays the RAT 7 is pretty huge. The scouts too will be able to take advantage of this when assaulting and again ignore the target in melee penalty so they can shoot from behind a faster unit. It's a useful feat but not a particularly fantastic one which means that Grim will be carried by his spells and abilities.
Tournament List
Here is my single list 35 point tournament list.
Legion of Everblight
Machinations of Shadow (Vayl, Consul of Everblight)
(Tier 4)
PCs: 35 / 35
25 models
[00] Vayl, Consul of Everblight (0 / 6 WB)
[08] >> Scythean
[08] >> Angelius
[08] >> Angelius
[02] >> Harrier
[01] Blighted Nyss Shepherd
[01] Blighted Nyss Shepherd
[04] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion
[06] Blighted Nyss Legionnaires (9 grunts)
[03] Spawning Vessel (6 grunts)
Legion of Everblight
Machinations of Shadow (Vayl, Consul of Everblight)
(Tier 4)
PCs: 35 / 35
25 models
[00] Vayl, Consul of Everblight (0 / 6 WB)
[08] >> Scythean
[08] >> Angelius
[08] >> Angelius
[02] >> Harrier
[01] Blighted Nyss Shepherd
[01] Blighted Nyss Shepherd
[04] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion
[06] Blighted Nyss Legionnaires (9 grunts)
[03] Spawning Vessel (6 grunts)
Why this list?
So I have a lot of choices when it comes to making a single list for a tournament but in the end it came down to three choices. The other two for curiosities sake were:
Mercenaries
Four Star Syndicate
PCs: 35 / 35
10 models
[00] Captain Bartolo Montador (0 / 5 WJ remaining)
[02] >> Sylys Wyshnalyrr, the Seeker
[18] >> Galleon
[02] Ragman
[02] Master Gunner Dougal Macnaile
[09] Wrong Eye
[00] >> Snapjaw (Companion)
[03] >> Bull Snapper
[04] Lady Aiyana & Master Holt
Cygnar
Standard Army
PCs: 35 / 35
14 models
[00] Major Victoria Haley (0 / 5 WJ remaining)
[02] >> Squire
[19] >> Stormwall
[03] Journeyman Warcaster
[06] Arcane Tempest Gun Mages
[02] >> Arcane Tempest Gun Mage Officer
[02] Gorman Di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist
[03] Eiryss, Angel of Retribution
[03] Ogrun Bokur
If you think that Haley2 list is odd you are correct. Rather than the standard Haley2 list I teched one to give me an advantage in the mirror match.
I rate myself as a half decent player, If I can give myself a fighting chance at the start of the game then I will back myself to win it. If you try and build a list that gives you too much of an advantage against some builds (for example you could take a Lylyth2 build with 3 ravagores) then you find yourself with some very bad matchups with you fighting heavily uphill. Even in a two list format the Bart Galleon player has another list. Whereas a more balanced list will still be strong against the good matchups but it still gives you a fighting chance in the not so good match ups (going back to Lylyth2 this would probably include Typhon instead of a third ravagore and the BFS as well and suddenly your list is good in melee).
What I want, especially in a one list environment is a list that has at least some fight against everything in the game. I want some answers for high ARM, I want some answers for high DEF, I want to be able to kill a colossal, I want to be able to kill a swarm of infantry. The list can't be shut down by Stormwall (the spell), or by Bestial or by covering fire templates (or Stormwall, not the spell), countermeasures, shadow pack, the choir, swamp pits, Janissa and the krielstone, crippling grasp, cloud or forest spam, inhospitable ground or mage hunter strike force.
Straight up purification answers more than half of those problems. High DEF and high ARM are almost always upkeeps and animi and a lot of those other effects are spells. Legion handles a lot of the rest, pathfinder and eyeless sight are huge. I have talked before about attrition vs scenario vs assassination. Vayl2 does all 3 and does them wonderfully. Double angels can repluse to clear zones/flags, she has 25" on the double obliteration assassinations. With refuge pulling the Angels to safety and admonition keeping the Scythean alive, and occultation and the pot making new lessers she attritions really well. It's quite hard to get to her beasts and her infantry turns into shredders (and on rare occasions stingers and harriers). It is straight up good. Even against Bart Galleon it has some answers, purification drops hot shot and all the animuses (including submerge on Wrong Eye). With a Naga I could assassinate Bart quite easily without one I can still get to the support staff. If I set Bart on fire then the assassanation is on the table. Against Haley2 who I think you always have to make sure you have a fighting game against, the assassination is greater than 80% on her feat turn. I don't care if I go 1-4 with this list if that one win is killing Haley2 on her feat turn.
Saturday, March 2, 2013
Morvahna's Feat
Feat: Blood Sacrifice - Morvahna immediately suffers 1 or more damage points. This damage cannot be transferred. For each damage point she suffers, return one destroyed non-character living friendly Faction warrior model to play completely within Morvahnaʼs control area. Units cannot exceed the number of models that they had at the start of the game as a result of Blood Sacrifice. Place returned trooper models in formation with their original units. Returned models forfeit their actions the turn they return to play.
This is from Bell of Lost Souls and they also have Grim's feat which I assume they will spoil tomorrow. As for Morvhana if she still has Restoration she is going to be amazing with Skinwalkers and they are some particularly beautiful models. She has Sac Pawn [faction warrior] in her primal form and I see no reason to take that away in her epic form so you'll probably still see Wolves of Orboros with her (though now I'm getting pretty deep into speculation).
I'm still excited about there being a light cav warlock. She is going to have a lot of movement, hopefully she has a few good offensive spells to really abuse that light cav move, or the ability to place clouds or forests. Getting a bit ahead of myself here, it's a bit sad how much more excited I am for this model than any of the warlocks from factions I actually play.
Also this:
First thought was Gobber mechanic but that looks like a dodgy arcane turbine on his back (like the generators warcasters use to control warjacks). A gobber warcaster I think is too much to hope for (plus I think then he'd have someone else carry his wagon) but I think it might be a Gobber Journeyman. That would be incredible. Regardless there is a lot I like about this model.
Friday, March 1, 2013
Makeda3's Feat
Has been spoiled (this one like the Lylyth3 one has been confirmed)
Feat: Dance of Death - When a model in Makeda’s battlegroup destroys one or more enemy models in her control area with an attack, either Makeda can gain 1 fury point or 1 fury point can be removed from a model in her battlegroup in her control area. Dance of Death lasts for one turn.That means that you can buy an attack and if you kill something remove the fury you just used to attack with. Put the bronzeback animus (beat back) on anything with reach and it will kill all the things, you can also do it with ranged attacks and the Mammoth has ROF 3. No word yet on her other abilities.
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